Employing Differences, Episode 197: Should I ask or tell?

[00:00:00] Karen: Welcome to Employing Differences, a conversation about exploring the collaborative space between individuals.

[00:0010] Paul: I'm Paul Tevis. 

[00:00:11] Karen: And I'm Karen Gimnig.

[00:00:12] Paul: Each episode, we start with a question and see where it takes us. This week's question is, should I ask or tell?

[00:00:21] Karen: So often in collaborative spaces, something's coming up and I want to have a conversation with somebody about it, and I have at least two choices of how to start that conversation. And the two that we're talking about today is one is I could say, hey, I've got this idea about what we could do or how we could solve our problem or whatever. 

[00:00:44] Karen: And then ask if they have any ideas, or I could start with saying, "Okay, we've got this problem. Do you have any ideas?" So do I start by asking the question or do I start by telling what I'm already thinking about? And the answer, of course, is complex, because this is on our podcast. And it really depends on what's going on in various ways because there are advantages to each in different situations. So that's what we want to explore today is when is it wise to start with your idea? When is it wise to start by asking somebody else for their idea?

[00:01:21] Paul: Yeah, this is where discernment, one of our favorite phrases, words comes in. And I think the place that I want to start is with usually recognizing what's my pattern? What's my pattern? What's my pattern with this person? Do I always start with a question? Do I always start by saying, what do you think we should do? Or do I always start with, here's what I think I should do? If you're always doing the same thing, and by always I mean like nine times out of ten, right? Then you're probably not choosing the thing that's useful for the situation, right? You're living that pattern, and very oftentimes that pattern can get exhausting for the other person in particular. 

[00:02:01] Paul: So for example, I am a person who my default for a long time has been to start with a question. I noticed we have this problem. What do you think we should do about it? And I have told myself the story that that's really useful to do because a lot of times in our culture, people, when they see a problem, they just start to problem solve on it and they go, this is what we should do. And it doesn't leave room for other people's opinions. 

 [00:02:24] Paul: And I always want to do that. And I've also been given the feedback that sometimes it seems like I'm making the other person do all the work because I'm making them actually have to put ideas in. So I've started to become much more conscious about do I have, like, what's going on with me? Like, what are the things that might actually influence whether or not I want to start with a question or I want to start with a statement? I want to start with an idea. I want to start with curiosity. Because if I'm just always doing the same thing, it's probably not what's actually useful for the situation.

[00:02:57] Karen: Yeah. And I think often we're doing the thing that we have learned somewhere in our life is safest. or easiest or, you know, like there's a reason we're doing it. And the question is, does it apply here? And if the reason is mostly about safety, that's probably not supporting the relationship, because in general, in a relationship, the thing that makes me feel safer makes the other person feel less safe. So I don't have to say what I want until I already know the lay of the land. And the way I do that is by making you say what you want before you know the lay of the land. It is exactly that unfair and it lands that way. 

[00:03:57] Karen: On the other hand, if there's more balance and more, or even reasoning for it. So, you know, my husband and I are thinking about hiring an architect and I've done a lot of my own design about this thing because I like to get out graph paper and draw on it. And I've already thought I'm not going to give them my plans in the first round. I'm going to say to them, I want your expertise and your creativity uninfected by my less experienced, less trained, less knowledgeable ideas. So I have a plan that I'm going to show you. But first, I want to see your initial concepts because I don't want to lose the best idea because I pushed mine. 

[00:04:15] Karen: So I think that kind of clarity, that kind of transparency about, yes, I've thought about it. And here's the reason that I want you to think about it before I tell you. And if there is a reason like that, like I don't want to interfere with their creativity and expertise, for example, then I think it can land really well. On the other hand, in the same situation, if I just didn't say anything to the architect, okay, you design it. And then after they've put a bunch of work into the design, I go, oh, but wait, I have a design I like better. They just want to curse at me. 

[00:04:47] Karen: Why did I let them go all that way down the road without telling them what I already knew? And I probably paid a bunch of fees for their time that I didn't need. So I think that's the kind of weighing about why am I doing it? And is there something served? And then also, how can I be transparent about what I'm doing so that they have a chance to say, no, I really need to see yours first, if that's the thing?

[00:05:08] Paul:  Part of that is about assessing what is your attachment to the idea that you already have, right? Because it could be, I've come up with this idea and I think it's kind of neat and I want to get some other ideas. And I trust that once other ideas come out, we can explore that space together, right? I trust that you're not just going to bulldoze or what have you. And so that can be a spot where it can be useful, and as you said, to be transparent about it. To go like, I've done some thinking about this, but I really want to see what you have first before I share that. Being transparent is useful there. 

[00:05:39] Paul: As opposed to the thing that's not useful, which is, I've done a lot of thinking about this. and I feel strongly about what we should do, and I'm just going to ask what you think. Because that's setting yourself up for disappointment, right? Because now you're starting to play this guessing game with the other person, you're really wanting them to guess your idea, and that's, there are patterns, you know, we talk about, you know, as you mentioned, like we have these patterns that we learn from somewhere. They're usually self-protective. But recognizing when that self-protective pattern is not serving you in this situation is a way that you can start to shift that. 

[00:06:16] Paul: And so, like I said, I'm often a person who I'm going to lead with, you know, what do you think? But I started to learn. "Hey, when I actually really care about what this is, I can be upfront about this. " And oftentimes I can then tag that, right? And I can say, you know, hey, I've thought about this, you know, I've noticed this situation or this problem. I want to bring it to your attention. I want to do some thinking with you about it. I've noticed that one of the things about it that's really important to me is, and I'm willing to consider other options, but I do feel strongly about this part of it right now. Now it's out there on the table because you might just say, no, that seems like the best idea. Let's just do that. And I can go, great. Right?

[00:06:54] Paul: Or you might say, let's explore that a little bit. So it's about creating the conditions for us to actually do that work together. And I think that's kind of one of the important pieces around like, you know, should I ask or tell? one of the pieces of discernment is asking yourself, is this actually going to help us move this? Is it going to move the problem forward? Are we going to be able to collaborate enough on this, you know, to the degree that this matters?

[00:07:18] Paul: One of the things we've been running into, home renovation is always, you know, one of these sorts of things where the problem needs to be solved and you think about this. And one of the things that came up in a conversation with our neighbors around that we need to replace the fence, right? And so I was starting to reach out to them around, you know, what do you want to do? And I was talking with my wife who said, you know, sometimes it's really important to give people something, you know, it's the opportunity to be heard, right? Which is what leading with curiosity can do. 

[00:07:45] Paul: But sometimes it can be really useful to give people something to agree with. and say, we've looked at this, we've dug into it, here's what we're really thinking about, and here's why we think this is a good option for us. Because it gives them the opportunity to say, yeah, sounds good. Whereas if we lead with, what do you want? They're like, "Oh, we got to do all this research, we got to do this, that, and the other thing." And it's like, that may or may not be useful. And so that's a piece around is, what's going to create the right conditions for the right level of collaboration on this?

[00:08:16] Karen: And I think collaboration is the tricky thing. For me, a failure mode is that I know what I want. And I think I know what will work best for the project or be best for the other people. Like I've got a really clear idea of where I want to go with this. But also, I really want them to want it too. And if I don't acknowledge that I've got my own internal game going here, where I don't in theory, just want my own way, but I actually really do. I want my own way, and I want them to fully endorse it.

[00:08:50] Karen:  And boy, that gets manipulative in a heartbeat. And it's so much cleaner if I can just say, I'm really clear about what I want with this, and I'm willing to hear other ideas, but actually, I'm pretty clear what I want. And that doesn't mean I can't change my mind, but it does give this position, which is very different than I actually don't mind. You know, another thing we before we turned on the recording for this one, we were talking about the where do you want to go for dinner question. 

[00:09:22] Karen: And I got to where my my first husband in particular would say, where do you want to go for dinner? And I would say, I don't want to decide. I have been making decisions all day long. I was home with kids at the time and he was off working. And I was like, half the reason to go out to dinner is so I don't have to decide what dinner is. That's my thing. Which is a different thing than if I then tried to come up with an answer, right? That transparency about where I am. And of course, that requires me to figure out where I am. But the ability to say, this is actually where I am. I have a clear idea. I don't have any idea. I'm very certain about what I want. I have an idea, but I actually don't care that much.

[00:10:06] Karen: I thought we might go to this restaurant, but I'm not at all attached. Or, man, I'm really craving that chowder place or whatever. And you can apply that beyond dinner, right? You can apply that to any situation. Where am I in giving that sense? And so if I either don't care very much or I really don't have any idea, leading with a question probably makes sense. If I care a lot and I have a clear idea, leading with what I've got probably makes sense. And it's usually not that clean. It's usually some combination of those things.

[00:10:44] Paul: Yeah. And the other place that I really see this show up is in organizations when it's like, I need to go to my manager to bring up a problem that I'm not sure how to solve. I don't have a solution to it. And, you know, we've heard the old saw about, you know, the manager says, don't bring me problems, bring me solutions. Right. And there are all kinds of issues with that. But it's like it can be really useful in that situation, recognizing, again, the dynamics of power, the situation that you're dealing with, like probably the overload that your manager is dealing with.

[00:11:16] Paul: How do we create the right conditions for collaboration there? How do we be transparent around where I'm coming from on this? Right. And so if I just go to my boss and just say, okay, this is a problem, What are you going to do about it? Right? That's very different than saying, I'm noticing this. I've thought about it. I've come up with a few options, but I don't think any of them will work. And I want your perspective on it. Like, that's both ways of bringing it to their attention, but creating very different conditions for collaboration. 

[00:11:47] Paul: And also being very, you know, differently transparent around where I'm at with this. And I think the more that we can do that, that really makes a difference. That in some ways, the transparency around it can make more of a difference than whether or not you actually lead with a question or lead with a statement.

[00:12:07] Karen: Yeah. And I think the other piece just to acknowledge here is that problem solving is work. And we may or may not have the capacity to do it. And so we alluded to this, you know, you were saying earlier about this idea of that if you're always just asking the question, you're asking the other person to do the work. But I think it also shows up in your fence example, where if you just say to the neighbor, here, we've got this idea, they can glance at it and go, sure. Whereas if we had led with, well, what would you like to do? 

[00:12:36] Karen: They have to go research fencing and think about what they want. And it's way more work. Is that a good use of resources? Is it a good idea to generate lots of options? Sometimes it is. Sometimes we need to know that we've made the absolute best decision. It's also possible that the best use of resources is, "Oh, there's an idea". That works somewhere amongst us, there is one idea, it will work, we can be done with this and move on to things that are more important to us. And of course, in that case, the benefit is to get that idea, whoever has it on the table as quickly as possible.

[00:13:11] Paul: A teacher of mine used to say that when you're solving problems, you can be in one of three states. You can have not enough ideas, you can have too many ideas, you can have exactly one good enough idea. And he said, when you get to that last one, you stop, right? And so it's really a question of like, what's going to help us get to that situation where we have a good enough idea that we can move forward with? 

[00:13:33] Paul: So, just kind of tracking where we've been here today, we're talking about when we notice a problem, when we're wanting to do some collaborative problem-solving with another person, do we start by asking a question? Do we start by telling them what we think? And recognizing that there's no single answer to that, that it depends on a number of factors.

[00:13:55] Paul: One of the things that we need to do is we need to recognize, like, what's our usual pattern for that? Which one do we often tend to do? We do those things for reasons. And it's really useful to ask, does that reason apply here? Oftentimes, our patterns of either making statements or asking questions comes from self-protective behavior. Is that thing that we need to protect ourselves from present in this situation?

[00:14:19] Paul: And if no, then we need to look a little bit deeper. But ultimately, what we're talking about is the fact that we're trying to create the conditions for collaboration, right? we can have the right level of collaboration for what the problem actually needs to get the right flow of ideas, to be transparent about where we're coming from, how strong is our feeling about this idea that we may have to really, you know, where are we at? What are we looking for? What are we hoping for?

[00:14:46] Paul: And just recognizing that problem-solving is work and that we don't want to necessarily put an undue burden on somebody else. We don't need to do more work than the problem really requires in order to get. And so those are some factors that can play into the question of whether or not we want to ask or whether or not we want to tell.

[00:15:05] Karen: And that's going to do it for us today. Until next time, I'm Karen Gimnig.

[00:15:07] Paul: And I'm Paul Tevis. And this has been Employing Differences.