Employing Differences, Episode 183: What if this can’t be fixed?

 

[00:00:00] Karen: Welcome to Employing Differences, a conversation about exploring the collaborative space between individuals.  

[00:00:12] Paul: I'm Paul Tevis.  

[00:00:14] Karen: And I'm Karen Gimnig.  

[00:00:16] Paul: Each episode, we start with a question and see where it takes us. This week's question is, what if this can't be fixed? 

[00:00:25] Karen: So We've noticed that we have a few episodes about fixing things, and I am definitely a problem solver. I am happiest if you can give me a problem and I can go fix it. And, you know, if some sort of creative solution or some significant amount of effort, even, but if I can go fix it, I'm a happy person. 

[00:00:47] Karen: And there are situations where that's not an option. And one of them, there are probably others where the same advice would apply. But the one that sort of brought this up is. When working with someone who is so frustrated, so activated, so upset about something that they aren't actually making good logical sense, like they're not cognitively functioning that well because they're so upset. 

[00:01:12] Karen: And this, by the way, can happen to any of us. So we're not talking about a particular personality type. We're more talking about a moment. And it may come from a series of unfortunate events, as they say, the Wi Fi goes down and the person that I need is late and my car broke down this morning and I spilled my coffee and... right?  

[00:01:31] Karen: And by the time I got to work, I was not functional. You know, I just sort of expect the world to be against me, that kind of thing.  

[00:01:37] Karen: So, if my coworker comes in in that state, or someone in community, or whatever. If that person is in front of me, and I would desperately love to fix everything for them, but I can't. How do I live with that?  

[00:01:56] Paul: And I think the challenge there, I know what comes up for me in those situations is this feeling that don't fix it, if I can't fix it, it's very easy to feel like I've failed in some way. Like that there ought to be a solution to something, and I ought to be able to help somebody figure out.  

[00:02:13] Paul: And if I can't, it's very easy for me to fall into this spot of, "Well, I'm just as helpless in this situation as they are", and that I can fall into that spiral of 'I'm not being supportive.' 'I'm not being a good coworker, a good partner' whatever it is.  

[00:02:29] Paul: There's two things that work there. One is my actual desire to solve problems and desire to have a sense of agency and feeling like I can affect things in the world and that's being thwarted. So that's not great for me.  

[00:02:42] Paul: But also because they're in this state of that as well and are probably pretty worked up about it. Which means we get into that sort of emotional contagion thing we've talked about on the show before.  

[00:02:52] Paul: So there's two things going on. They're telling themselves a story about how nothing works and about how they can't accomplish anything. 

[00:03:00] Paul: And I'm telling myself that same story at the same time, because I can't fix them. I can't fix the situation. I can't help them. And so it seems like I have this dilemma of like, I either need to fix it, or I'm going to fall into this pit of despair, or anger, or whatever emotionally reactive state I get to when I have that feeling of helplessness come up. 

[00:03:21] Karen: Yeah. And I think helplessness is a really important word here. Because I hate it so much. Like it is the most vulnerable, dangerous. Like, throw me in a pit full of lions and if I think I can do something about it, even if the odds are against me, I can do something.  

[00:03:39] Karen: But to be just absolutely helpless, and all I can really do is maybe I can be present for that person. Maybe I can offer a lifeline here or there, but odds are they're not ready.  

[00:03:51] Karen: I mean, if they're ready for help, then sure help, but we're talking about the situation where they're not. Where I can throw them a lifeline and they'll just say, "That won't work anyway."  

[00:04:00] Karen: You know, like, any suggestion I make, they're gonna bat it away. There's really nothing I can do. And nothing I can do... It feels terrible.  

[00:04:10] Karen: And so I run away from that. And I go, 'Well, what if I did this?' And 'What if I did that?' And 'Maybe I could go get them a new cup of coffee' and 'Maybe I could call their car mechanic for them.' Or maybe like- and none of that actually will work. 

[00:04:25] Karen: Because ultimately, that's not the problem, right? Ultimately, the problem at the moment is that they're so activated. They're not thinking straight. And they're going to need to solve their own problem. And maybe they even need to learn whatever lessons they need from it. Or maybe they just have to get through the day until tomorrow and it will be better. You know, whatever those things are.  

[00:04:45] Karen: Learning to live with "I can't help", "I am helpless", is a really tough one. And absolutely essential.  

[00:04:54] Karen: Because the sad truth is as much as we like to have agency, as much as we like to be competent and capable, the world does throw at us situations that we can't fix. And figuring out how to be okay about that turns out to be super important. 

[00:05:12] Paul: And hard. I mean, fundamentally, what this is kind of talking to is this idea of acceptance, right? Of seeing the thing as it is, even though we wish that it were not that way. And I know this is something that I've struggled with a lot in over the last couple of years around a number of different things. 

[00:05:34] Paul: One of the things that I found myself saying recently around this, that's been useful to me is recognizing that I was caught in a dilemma. And it felt like if I did accept that this was how things were, that that was a sign that I didn't care. I actually realized that I could have both, right? 

[00:05:52] Paul: I could say, "Look, I can see how these things are. I can see that there's nothing that I can really do about that. And the fact that I'm accepting that doesn't mean that I don't care. It doesn't mean that I don't wish that it were otherwise.  

[00:06:06] Paul: And for me holding that being able, that kind of calms me down being able to say, I can care about this and also recognize that there's nothing that I can really do. 

[00:06:16] Paul: And for a long time, I didn't realize that was an option. And, you know it's challenging, but I think that part of the story that I was telling myself for a long time, and I think the story we tell ourselves when we're in these situations, is if we recognize that there's nothing we can do. If we go, "There is no real fix for this right now", that that's a type of despair.  

[00:06:37] Paul: And it doesn't have to be, right? It's not giving up. It's recognizing how things are.  

[00:06:44] Karen: And I really like that frame of 'the story we tell ourselves' because I think that's what this is about. If it can't be fixed, we can't, in a podcast, tell you how to fix it. There's not a way out of this one. But there is a way through it.  

[00:06:58] Karen: And I do think it's a lot about 'the story I'm telling myself', which is "It's okay to be helpless." 

[00:07:07] Karen: It feels horrible and I hate it. And I may have to apply some coping mechanisms, but maybe not the ones that make it worse. Right. Like the ones that I want to chase after.  

[00:07:17] Karen: If I can stay in my right mind enough to say, "Okay, chasing after a fix when there isn't one isn't going to work." if I can let myself know, "Okay, I'm helpless on this one. This is a helplessness moment."  

[00:07:30] Karen: And maybe I go out for a run if that's my thing, or maybe I bake muffins if that's my thing, or maybe I, you know, fall into Netflix, or talk it out with a friend, or call my therapist, or write in a journal. It's not necessarily the case that I'm just going to say, "Okay, I'm helpless. Oh, well, I'll just go on with my life." It probably not.  

[00:07:50] Karen: But "Okay, this is a hopelessness moment. It's hard. I can't help over there." I can say I'm available. I can be loving and caring and present, but I can't do anything for them. So how do I take care of me?  

[00:08:09] Paul: There's three things that you said in there that I want to unpack, that I think are really valuable. 

[00:08:13] Paul: One is, you know, this idea of putting on your own oxygen mask first. You noticing that you don't want to get sucked into that emotional vortex. And so you need to do what's necessary to care for yourself. To work with that uncomfortableness of being with those feelings of helplessness and to sort of give yourself whatever you need in order to be able to live and work with that. 

[00:08:35] Paul: The second thing is when you know that that's a thing that happens, right, this feeling that things can't be fixed. And that like, it's gonna come up. As much as we would love to be able to prevent that from happening, we also know that these are things that occur. And so being able to do some planning ahead of time of like, 'Hey, when I get into this state, what helps me recover from it?'  

[00:08:59] Paul: Knowing that, 'Oh, yeah, when I discover I'm in a situation where I can't fix something and these feelings of helplessness are coming up and I'm having difficulty accepting it, what I'm going to want to do is go for a run and McMuffins are talking to me'.  

[00:09:11] Paul: Like, having a plan for it. Because trying to figure out what to do in the moment, while you're starting to experience that emotional overwhelm, can be super hard. 

[00:09:20] Paul: So it's this idea of really, what's the recovery protocol? When the thing that I don't want to have happen happens, what am I going to do about it?  

[00:09:29] Paul: And then the third thing is. You know, being able to do that, to get yourself in that state where you can't necessarily fix the problem. You can't change the circumstance, right? That's triggering it.  

[00:09:42] Paul: But how can you still be with the other person? How can you not put on your own oxygen mask in such a way that they can't see or hear you anymore?  

[00:09:51] Paul: But like, how can you meet them emotionally? Because even though we can't fix the situation, we may not be able to change the thing that's going on. 

[00:10:01] Paul: How do we be with the other person in such a way that they don't feel abandoned by us? That we can at least acknowledge what they're feeling, that we can be with them?  

[00:10:13] Paul: I've sometimes heard the phrase 'meeting them emotionally' used here. Where it's just like, how can we acknowledge where they are, and not try to fix the problem? 

[00:10:23] Paul: But just acknowledge that it's frustrating, or anger inducing, or whatever it is, in a way that helps them feel heard. So there is still something there between us, that there is some connection, that there is some relationship, even though what we want more than anything else is to just make that go away. 

[00:10:42] Karen: Absolutely. So we started with, "What if this can't be fixed?" And I think where we're mostly going is first acknowledging: "Yep, this is a thing that can't be fixed." Despite all of our fabulous, creative, intellectual powers to coming up with solutions to problems, this time, that isn't going to work for us. 

[00:11:06] Karen: And living with the helplessness of 'As much as I would like to be competent and capable and have agency, this time, the best I can do is acknowledge that I can't do anything. I can be present and supportive. I can apply empathy to what's going on for that other person, if that's where it's coming from.' 

[00:11:27] Karen: And then I can do the self care thing. I can take care of me. Recognizing that helplessness is a icky, awful feeling. You don't want to just stuff it and bury it. Do what you need to do to get through, to recover from that feeling of helplessness. That's not just a feeling, the reality of helplessness, the acknowledgement of helplessness. 

[00:11:48] Karen: So that you can still be conscious and present for that other person, and come out on the other side of it with relationship intact. And capability of dealing with the things that you can do something about.  

[00:12:04] Paul: Well, that's going to do it for us today. Until next time, I'm Paul Tevis.  

[00:12:08] Karen: And I'm Karen Gimnig. And this has been Employing Differences.